Comments on: 2011 APBRmetric All-Stars http://www.basketball-reference.com/blog/?p=8779 NBA & ABA Basketball Statistics & History Mon, 21 Nov 2011 20:56:04 +0000 hourly 1 https://wordpress.org/?v=4.6 By: Ian http://www.basketball-reference.com/blog/?p=8779&cpage=3#comment-43392 Tue, 15 Feb 2011 10:18:49 +0000 http://www.basketball-reference.com/blog/?p=8779#comment-43392 Another potential wrinkle to consider: What about fast break opportunities created by defensive rebounds?

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By: EvanZ http://www.basketball-reference.com/blog/?p=8779&cpage=3#comment-43353 Tue, 15 Feb 2011 00:18:02 +0000 http://www.basketball-reference.com/blog/?p=8779#comment-43353 thanks! i'll be here all the week.

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By: observer http://www.basketball-reference.com/blog/?p=8779&cpage=3#comment-43352 Tue, 15 Feb 2011 00:14:19 +0000 http://www.basketball-reference.com/blog/?p=8779#comment-43352 I'd like to congratulate EvanZ and AYC for their intellectual stamina. This argument has been going on for almost 5 days!

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By: DSMok1 http://www.basketball-reference.com/blog/?p=8779&cpage=3#comment-43336 Mon, 14 Feb 2011 19:30:46 +0000 http://www.basketball-reference.com/blog/?p=8779#comment-43336 @137 precisely

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By: Anon http://www.basketball-reference.com/blog/?p=8779&cpage=3#comment-43322 Mon, 14 Feb 2011 17:11:59 +0000 http://www.basketball-reference.com/blog/?p=8779#comment-43322 "This is similar to the Monty Hall problem of mathematics, you can be a very intelligent mathematician and yet fail to "believe" the solution."

You can lead a horse to water...

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By: EvanZ http://www.basketball-reference.com/blog/?p=8779&cpage=3#comment-43320 Mon, 14 Feb 2011 17:08:36 +0000 http://www.basketball-reference.com/blog/?p=8779#comment-43320 "I get the value that hitting 3s adds, but not missing shots."

I don't think you do in this particular situation. The 3's are what created the value by potentially saving an extra possession.

That's why when you're down by 6 points with 20 seconds left, you need to go for 2 3's, not 3 2's.

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By: AYC http://www.basketball-reference.com/blog/?p=8779&cpage=3#comment-43318 Mon, 14 Feb 2011 17:03:26 +0000 http://www.basketball-reference.com/blog/?p=8779#comment-43318 "It doesn't matter what definition of possession you use."

I'm glad we can agree on that.

"What matters is that an extra rebound opportunity increases the expected point total."

Yes, that's why I credit the rebounder.

"You still don't seem to get that B enables one more offensive rebound opportunity"

My point is that the Orb and putback doesn't accomplish anything more than if the original shot attempt had been made in the first place. The goal of the offense is not to grab Orbs, but to shoot more efficiently than the opponent; that's how you win games. It's possible to get more shot attempts than your opponent, but usually not that many more, thanks to the shot-clock; and teams win games with fewer shot attempts than their opponents all the time. Usually the team that attempts more shots just has more misses.

There are three ways I can think of to get more shot attempts: you can steal the ball, benefit from a turnover, or get an Orb. In the first two cases it's possible to get consecutive made field goals, but in the case of Orbs, it's not possible. Because the ORb merely cancels out the missed shot that made the Orb possible/necessary. I get the value that hitting 3s adds, but not missing shots.

Anyway, it's been fun. I think I've made my point, and we're starting to go 'round in circles, so this is my final post on the matter.

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By: Zeiram http://www.basketball-reference.com/blog/?p=8779&cpage=3#comment-43317 Mon, 14 Feb 2011 17:03:10 +0000 http://www.basketball-reference.com/blog/?p=8779#comment-43317 I don´t want to denounce AYC here! This is similar to the Monty Hall problem of mathematics, you can be a very intelligent mathematician and yet fail to "believe" the solution. It is all hard to understand and almost has to be understood intuitively, yet and this is the important part: IT IS STILL A FACT. (Had to get that out of me)

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By: EvanZ http://www.basketball-reference.com/blog/?p=8779&cpage=3#comment-43315 Mon, 14 Feb 2011 16:58:07 +0000 http://www.basketball-reference.com/blog/?p=8779#comment-43315 "The answer seems pretty clear..."

you'd think so, right?

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By: DSMok1 http://www.basketball-reference.com/blog/?p=8779&cpage=3#comment-43314 Mon, 14 Feb 2011 16:54:30 +0000 http://www.basketball-reference.com/blog/?p=8779#comment-43314 Ha! I didn't know you had done it first. The answer seems pretty clear...

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